Someone Has to Put a Foot Down

299 thoughts on “Someone Has to Put a Foot Down”

1. My wife and I just can’t seem to escape this dreadful song as we have been trying to find a church lately. In our latest attempt I told her “they are probably going to sing the hurricane song”. She was agast. It took 3 weeks but they sang it last Sunday. We’ve heard it played in a variety of ways and it is always a bad experience. I think what is most difficult about this song are the lyrics themselves. They are just creepy. Coming from South Florida and experience many a hurricane, the last thing I want to relate to God is that his love is like a hurricane. Hurricane’s are destructive and there is nothing good about them. But yet, I am supposed to suspend my belief and praise God’s love for having a destuctive love? Eh, no. But as I told my wife, this song has it all. It is the pinnacle of what is wrong with so-called worship music these days.

   The initial hurricane reference is more than enough, but it keeps building; getting worse with every line. It’s not just that God’s love is LIKE a hurricane, he actually (apparently) has wind of his own and his grace is measurable (bending beneath his wind and his mercy). It gets better. “..All of a sudden, I am unaware of these afflictions ecclipsed by His glory.” Eh? What afllictions, His wind? All of a sudden? It just took you by suprise?

   From them on, it’s pretty much me, me, me. Whoa! me, he loves me. As if singing it over and over and louder is suppose the breakthrough and prove the point that God loves us? Does God really love us that way? Does God really give us a “sloppy big kiss” (kind of blashpemous if you ask me). It kind of reduces God to a simpering, gushing well-spring of love, love, lobe for ME, ME, ME! But what about his holiness and the fear of God? I, for one, don’t even want to think about God planting a “sloppy” kiss on me. Sinful me and a holy God? Yes, I believe that He loves me more than I can explain in human terms. Sorry, but God is not my lover. I am loved by Him indeed, but taking it to such a fleshy anthropomorphic conclusion is out-of-bounds. Do with that what you will.

   Oh, back to the song. You know it just keeps getting “deeper”. We didn’t get it with the sloppy kiss, but God is so amazing that apparently “my heart turns violently inside my chest.” Seriously. Turns violently? Like side-to-side, or upside-down or what. Is this a heart attack. Perhaps too much wind or too much saliva from the sloppy kiss.

   Church we can do better than this. It is by His grace that we are saved and he didn’t grant that grace so He could “Love” on us. His is the King and we are his servants. We are not equal with Him and it’s a good thing to fear God and stand in awe of him. Yes, we can boldly approach the throne, but with reverence and much trembling.

   It is a sad thing that worship has sunk to to level it has and I pray that God will again grant us mercy to worship Him in the beauty of holiness.

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2. Nothing like finding yourself in a RL South Park episode, eh?

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3. I agree with Ryan. And when we pull it out of context and we criticize songwriters for romanticizing worship, let’s not assume that it is only recent-style songwriting that is vulnerable to this critique. I can remember my parents singing this Bill Gaither song:

   He touched me
   Yes, he touched me
   and oh, the joy that floods my soul
   Something – happened – – and now I KNOW…

   I first heard this song as a young kid, about the same time that my school was teaching us how to defend ourselves against predatory adults. While my parents found the chorus inspiring, I found it unnerving.

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4. Well, I know I’m in the minority here, but I actually really like this song. I think the poetry of the verses is actually quite beautiful. I am not a poet, but for some reason those lines get me every time.

   I think one of the reasons I like it so much is because, knowing the song’s backstory, it is like a fragile fist held high in the midst of the Problem of Evil – a declaration of God’s love in a situation where it seems He’s left the building.

   My favorite verse in the song is the one that’s never sung corporately:

   I thought about You, the day Stephen died
   And You met me between my breaking
   You know I still love you God despite the agony
   Some people want to tell me You’re cruel but…
   If Stephen could sing he’d say it’s not true cause He loves us…Oh how he loves us…

   When I sing “How He Loves,” usually I’m thinking about the mystery of the Problem of Evil. I’m thinking about how – In spite of the evidence to the contrary – God really does love us. When I’m singing it, it helps me to feel what I already say I believe.

   One thing the song is NOT is a standard, trite, cliche-ridden, paint-by-numbers worship song. It’s raw and the words DON’T make sense at first glance, but whether it’s “great poetry” or not it strikes me as real.

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5. Your heart does come through, Dan. Perhaps the setting and integration of this song into the service you observed made it more useful. One of the complaints I had in the service I attended is that the song did not seem to have anything to do with the rest of the service.

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6. I am not a big contemporary Christian music lover…and rarely listen to Christian radio and know the latest pop songs. And I have been overly critical at times of it too. Having said that, I don’t see anything wrong with this song mentioned. I say that as I was speaking to around 1,000 teenagers in Portland earlier this year and the band played this very song being discussed here. I watched the teenagers sing it back, not in a frenzy or mindless fashion – and this was a conservative evangelical group as well. But they were singing it and taking in the truth that they were loved by their Father in Heaven. “How He loves them so”.

   I was watching them, I was thinking what a beautiful thing it was for them to be focusing on this truth for a few minutes. Here were teenagers who get beat down in culture, their identity torn and understanding of who they even are as children of God distorted through the messages and reality of living in today’s confusing world. Perhaps some of them don’t even understand love or experience being loved by their parents or friends. Yet for a few moments in this meeting, they were singing the reminder of how much God does love them and focusing on that. “How great is the love the Father has lavished on us..” 1 John 3:1…… ” I pray that you grasp…how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ” Eph 3…..”As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you.” John 15:9…… I didn’t at all see this as narcissistic, but a few minutes of the teenagers singing together and being reminded of no matter what the world, culture etc. teaches them to think about themselves, that the truth is they are loved.

   I have 2 twin nine year old daughters and every time I can, I want them to know I love them unconditionally. I hope that throughout their day they live with that truth and feel confident their dad “loves them so”. — So with this song being discussed, I guess I don’t see the error in for a few moments of this worship gathering which also had other songs sang and 35 minutes of teaching from Scripture, to be reminded of this truth of God’s love for us. And I was thankful to God for the song seeing those teenagers singing it and being reminded of that truth.

   Now if all we did was focus on “me” and how much God loves “me”, then I can see it being off kilter and develop the focus on self vs. God and others. But not every song at this event was that. So for a few minutes, I was very glad this song was song. And thankful these teenagers were reminded of the truth that God does love them so -despite what they may be experiencing from other people or culture. I hope my daughters when they read “I love you” on cards or notes that I write are reminded of that truth. Or when Jesus said “so I have loved you”… and the many other times in Scriptures we are reminded of God’s love for us that, that we don’t need to be reminded of “how he loves us so” or that we are narcissistic to ponder and dwell on that truth for a few moments in a song. You may not appreciate the poetry of the lyrics, but we could probably look at some hymns and say the same thing. Or even some Psalms and wonder about why certain metaphors or images were used to describe things. All I know is I was thankful that those teenagers were reminded of the truth of God’s love for them as they sang this one song. And it was one part of a whole worship gathering that also included others songs, Scriptural teaching etc. Thanks for reading! Hope my heart comes through in this.

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7. Oh, I should mention that the web address is pauliethinkingoutloud.blogspot.com

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8. I have a response to this post written on my blog. Check it out!

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9. I don’t know Chaplain, when one looks at the real concerns of the world (i.e. the use of child soldiers in foreign countries, sex trafficking, starvation, poverty, AIDS epidemic, homelessness….) Your critique of corporate worship starts to look real small, and quite petty. I’m sorry, just call ’em like a see ’em.

   Why don’t we get busy being a blessing to the world, rather than trying to customize the perfect worship experience (which is very much subjective by the way)?

   Why don’t we “put our foot down” for the things that actually matter…

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10. 25 years ago, I began writing “contemporary Christian music.” It’s not that I hated the hymns. It’s more that I wanted to be a successful singer/songwriter. To date I have written and sung about 100 works. And as I go back over them, the thing that I notice about almost all of them is that they are themed directly from something in the Bible. Many times they are even quoting Scripture. I remember putting the lyrics to one of my songs on a Christian chat site once. The response I got was “That is really textual.” Exactly! Because, as it turns out, the thing that makes the hymns great is that they reinforce what the Bible says. They allow a response to the Biblical message of the day. This is a very liturgical idea, and it is also a very evangelical idea at the same time. Because the very meaning of evangelical is “telling the Good News” and the very meaning of liturgical is to make all things work together in an orderly way to preach the whole “Good News” of God.

    At church, we have a praise band, and many instrumentalists, and use several different genres. But the one thing that is a must is that the message of God and his Gospel is always from and center.

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11. “Doesn’t a lot of this continuing discussion have to do with what we remember from our own experiences? Why isn’t it all right to be moved by a certain song if that song brings you closer to worshipping God in your own experience?”

    I don’t think the point of the original post was to stake out some kind of fight of traditional vs. contemporary worship music. Chaplain Mike’s post wondered about the _appropriateness_ of the song for congregational worship, for the reasons he lists above. I don’t think he, or anyone else, is arguing that contemporary worship music is bad simply for being, well, contemporary.

    And no, there’s nothing wrong with being moved by a song, particularly if that “movement” draws you into a deeper awareness and love of God. However, I have to wonder if that should be the point of worship – some kind of subjective, experiential moment (or moments)? Shouldn’t we worship because it is _right_ to do so, because God deserves to be worshipped, and out of the belief that, in some way, focusing on God will help us to conform to the likeness of Christ?

    My main struggles with contemporary worship music isn’t the _music_ itself; that is, I love modern pop and rock and think the musical forms can easily be adapted and used for healthy worship. My problem is that lyrics are often near-pablum, seem very “me-centered,” and also seem intent more on producing/forcing an experience or mood rather than reminding us of critical truth.

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12. But it doesn’t really say anything about the Gospel, which is the way he loves us.

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13. This is good perspective. Again, the original issue is not the song itself, but its use in the congregational worship.

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14. I have to bump Phil’s comments from earlier in the thread, especially in context of CM’s other post about being a hospice chaplain. The song was originally written not as a church-service-singalong, but as a confession from a songwriter trying to process the instant death of his close friend who was in a car accident – “when all of the sudden I am unaware of these afflictions eclipsed by glory”. The lines “loves like a hurricaine” and the “heaven meets earth like a sloppy wet kiss” are not supposed to be sensible analogies – – they’re supposed to reflect the difficulties of trying to understand how God loves us while he allows us to walk through the tragedies of life.
    Feel free to criticize the music pastors who turn this into a Sunday morning “Jesus is my boyfriend” song, but don’t level that charge at John Mark Macmillan’s original songwriting without first hearing the song in its original context.
    In fact, I would daresay that the album it came from (The Song Inside the Sounds of Breaking Down) might resonate with much of what IM readers have previously written elsewhere on this website, and you may find it refreshingly honest even if it’s not theologically perfect.

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15. One of the worship leaders at the church I go to defende this song bu saying that the best way we can love God is by accepting how much God loves us. Thoughts?

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16. Jeff, why do you have something against having Jesus in the heart?

    🙂

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17. Not only did we have the Beatles in Ireland, we had Ireland in the Beatles (Liverpool Irish, to be exact). 😉

    “She loves you, yeah, yeah, yeah” is a great song, but it’s not a hymn. Unless you want us to try singing “Lady Madonna” or “Let It Be” as Marian hymns?

    😀

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18. For what it’s worth, wife said they wimped out and went with the safe lyrics: “unforeseen kiss”.

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19. Nope – this station is okay. A little bit of the Eagles, some CCR, and half an hour of Led Zeppelin every evening. Not a bad way to pass a couple hours.

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20. Aw, c’mon, that’s pushing it. I’ve heard the Word preached in several churches over the past several years, including the services of the church body I am a part of. I attend FOR that reason. It’s non-denominational, by the way. There is both a traditional worship service and a more contemporary worship service.

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21. “build a congregation and not an audience”????? Congregating for what other reason than to hear the music and watch the performance. I hate to sound like such a pessimist but I think it’s too late. The only congregations that I am aware of that gather to hear the word and for mutual edification are in the Amish/Mennonite churches and the persecuted churches. I just purchased a CD of an Amish Chorale and of course no musical instruments are used except the beautiful voices. A friend of mine (70 years young) who is a member of my former large, loud, contemporary music centered church listened to two of the songs. I said, “Aren’t they beautiful.” Very lukewarm response. Just a quiet “lovely”. We get desensitized to beauty I fear. Beauty, silence and peace.

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22. I heard that one, or maybe it was a similar one, a few days ago and had the same thought. ‘Jesus pop’ love songs.

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23. Thanks for the reminder, Andy. *wink

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24. Playing the devil’s advocate here, but Mike don’t you know that anything is ok if it has good intentions behind it? The song and many like it “want” to do the right thing… That’s rule number one. The other rule is that you must never “judge” anything in the evangelical subculture because – well, God is probably using it somewhere, somehow… and if you “judge” in this way you sound too much like Bill Maher and he’s an evil liberal who hates christianity – you don’t want to be like him… So you must be encouraging; always encouraging of everything and don’t think too critically about anything because then you can see how God’s going to use it and you can keep that happy face ever glowing…and never face the mediocrity and narcissism plaguing the church.

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25. Can I try?

    I sure do appreciate, the fact that you are near
    Your love is so beautiful, and your Word, it is so clear
    So preacher, fetch a Bible
    We’ll read it every day
    So baby, why don’t we get saved, and pray?

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26. You know, Ted. I have thought at various times that I would do a post about “As the Deer.” I have not, primarily because I was sure there would be relatively few who knew what I was talking about. After all, the 70’s and 80’s are ancient history now.

    I think this song, however, is a prime example of both the appeal and the problem with contemporary praise music. It is appealing in its simplicity, its Biblical metaphors, and the immediacy of its emotional resonance.

    However, if you compare it to the psalms it references (Psalm 42/43 in particular), you realize that it actually bears little resemblance to them. They are earthy and raw and express emotions that are deeper and more desperate than the “pretty” praise chorus. They are songs of emotional chaos and struggle, not songs of trust and adoration. There is no “lament” in “As the Deer,” yet that is the very nature of these psalms.

    There is a place for both, but I see precious little of the ethos of the Biblical psalms in Christian worship. Even most of our hymns are not as robust.

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27. “Sing to the Lord a new song!”

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28. Not surprising given that I used to think that the opening line to “Earth Angel” was “her thing, Joe”, but disturbing nonetheless.

    There’s a webcomics artist who goes by the pen name of “Kinky Turtle”. Comes from a mishearing of “O King Eternal” as a kid — he heard it as “Kinky Turtle” and thought it’d be a great name for a cartoon character.

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29. Just so long as their idea of “Classic Rock” isn’t “Dope is Groovy” and “Get Out of Vietnam”. We had an oldies station on our PA at work once that was like that. Employee mutiny within two days.

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30. South Park: The Gift of Prophecy.

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31. Hear Hear Chaplain Mike! But your article may seem about 20 years behind the trend. To quote Miguel, this is now a “modern worship industry”. And there is much money to be made for the right sounding repetitive track. For years we jokingly call these songs 7/11 hymns, 7 words repeated 11 times. The purpose of the song is to put people into the mood of worship. The question to ask though is what is being worshiped? I believe this is a major point of contention being leveled at today’s modern worship services. Having grown up in the 70s – 80s music culture, I really don’t see much difference in the music being played or the response of the audience. Both use lights, mellow smooth vocals, catchy phases, electric synthesized instruments, and above all, good looking young people performing on stage. I worshiped back then, but at the time, I did not know what I was worshiping, yet the emotions evoked were very similar. Yes, I know Christ is mentioned in the lyrics in a modern worship service, I only wonder if people would notice if they left His name out.

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32. I understand the complaints somewhat, but something about this whole post and a lot of the comments make me sad. Worship should definitely be just that: worship (not a concert, so yeah, repetitive lyrics are sometimes obnoxious and I stop singing after a couple of repetitions because I don’t really feel like I’m singing to God at that point anymore). I don’t think there is anything harmful in these lyrics, in fact, I think they are powerful and symbolic of one’s interaction with God. This song helps me remember God’s mercy and love along with His strength. It may not be terribly eloquent, but I daresay that our relationships with Christ are not the most poetic at times either. Anyway, it’s worship to me.

    When you get down to it though, shouldn’t worship be both an intellectual and an emotional experience? It’s not pedestrian to say that one is emotionally affected by worship. Old hymns can praise God, new “hymns” can praise God. This song DOES say something positive about why people are assembled — to praise God. There’s nothing abominable here, even if it isn’t the best choice for corporate worship.

    Additionally, I must admit that I find a lot of melodies difficult to sing, especially when singing from a hymnal in a more traditional church service. In such circumstances, it seems as though elderly church ladies have it right — belt it out anyway. God is the audience. Also, perhaps the problem is that there is an “industry” at all — maybe that is the “plague?” The cookbook is a huge leap from the song at issue here. Check out the lyrics again. Regarding point 5, there is truth in some of these songs. I don’t really want to sing out chapters verbatim from the Word either. To each his own, as long as “his own” is worshiping God and not oneself.

    There is always something wrong with worship from someone’s point of view, including, often, mine. That’s part of the trouble that maybe we should be focusing on a bit more. I’m such a crank sometimes regarding the church, but it does me a disservice.

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33. I like “As the Deer” quite a lot, but now that you’ve mentioned it I’ll get this off my chest: It’s always bugged me that the pronouns are all wrong.

    “You alone are my heart’s desire
    and I long to worship thee.”

    OK, campers: If we start with “You” (the formal singular nominative), we should finish with “you” (the formal singular objective, coincidentally the same as the nominative). Not “thee”. Not “thee”. No matter how Shakespearean we think we are. Or KJV, for that matter.

    However, if we insist upon finishing with “thee” (the familiar singular objective, now archaic), that’s fine, let’s go for it; but in that case we should begin with “Thou” (the familiar singular nominative, also archaic).

    Other than that little bit of linguistic schizophrenia, the song’s a hit.

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34. I won’t comment on the song in question because I’ve never heard it or heard of it until now. However, to respond to comments about traditional hymns vs. contemporary-one being remembered and the other soon forgotten, I disagree. I know the words to traditional hymns because I sang them growing up. My 34 year-old son remarked tonight that he liked the music at a particular church (they use worship choruses and contemporary songs) because that’s what he grew up with. Doesn’t a lot of this continuing discussion have to do with what we remember from our own experiences? Why isn’t it all right to be moved by a certain song if that song brings you closer to worshipping God in your own experience?

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35. A lot of worship musicj lacks immagation. I’ve thought that to myself for years….

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36. I have a confession to make…. I listened to Savior King while working out at the gym. It was the only thing I had in my gym bag. Oh Martha of Ireland or Chaplin Mike…how much penance should I do? 😛

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37. Sadly that’s probably why Mark Driscoll is popular. I don’t know if you heard the latest with him. It’s kind of like a neo-reformed “Sixth Sense”. Except instead of seeing dead people he’s seeing people get molested or have affairs! 😯

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38. Is this it? 🙂

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39. I’m not accusing HUG of sexism; he’s definitely not sexist. I just think his wit ran away with him.

    And he is right in reminding us that extreme emotionalism in Christian expression is nothing new; some very male medievals were also involved, notably Bernard of Clairvaux.

    Dana

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40. The one that makes me want to hurl, that’s currently getting significant air time, is Hold Me by Jamie Grace:

    I don’t know how many times she sings the line: “I love, I love, I love, I love the way you hold me,” but it’s definitely too many.

    And in the chorus? “Lord, I love the way You hold me.”
    Simply replace Lord with Babe, and presto, instant sappy pop love song!

    It’s no wonder I’m currenly listening to my area’s classic rock station.

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41. Really? Most modern worship annoys me but I actually think Hillsong United is legit (even if the church kind of creeps me out) and has a good number of songs that aren’t just me-fests. And they certainly deserve credit for being instrumentally skilled and musically interesting and not repeating the same three words over and over again, as McMillian’s song and my personal favorite punching bag, “How Great Is Our God.” On the contrary, my experience has been that just about every OTHER popularly-used praise artist/band/whatever’s songs have been painfully simple and repetitive. Guess it just depends on the church.

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42. I think you’re right on target despite the accusations of sexism. Church in so many ways is so heavily geared toward women that it’s just astonishing. Sure plenty of men go through the hyper-emotional motions too, but is it really any wonder that it’s so hard to get guys in church?

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43. Such pettiness.

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44. God-fearing Baptist? Lobster-licking?

    Lee, are you talking about me??? 🙂

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45. But his masterpiece is probably reciting Elton John’s “Rocket Man”.

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46. Off-topic and politically-charged, but Shatner also does a passable Sarah Palin.

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47. Funny you should mention that, HUG, and while Dylan’s ears are burning. I once heard his “If Not for You” sung in church (it was in 1980, while he was still considered among the fold) and all the singer had to do was change “babe” to “Lord” and it worked!

    If not for you
    Lord, I couldn’t find the door
    Couldn’t even see the floor
    I’d be sad and blue
    If not for you

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48. “Going “Whoa! Yeah! He loves me, yeah, yeah, yeah” – repeat ad infinitum – not so much.”

    You didn’t have the Beatles in Ireland???

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49. No, that’s fine with me since I’m a Bob Dylan fan myself. 🙂

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50. My wife went to a wedding on the eve of the hurricane, and it turns out the bride had chosen this song as part of the ceremony. My wife brought the program home and as I was looking at it I noticed the lyrics to one of the songs: “heaven meets earth like a sloppy wet kiss.”

    “Interesting,” I thought, and then it was suppertime; but now you’ve re-piqued that interest. I’ll ask her how it went over.

    BTW, she played flute for the processional and during a hymn, but I guarantee not for this one.

    Hmm… Just had an awful thought. Our youth pastor/music leader led the ceremony, and I’d be willing to bet the song shows up at First Baptist one of these Sunday mornings. Pray for me.

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51. Wait, were you in the row of chairs behind me? ‘Cause I didn’t see you in the service that day … lol

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52. You win, Rea — at least our “worship leader” didn’t expect us to do THAT …

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53. As Martin Luther reportedly said, “Christians don’t tell lies, we sing them” …

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54. Well, ok, not everyone is going to get it. But consider how many this post resonates with so strongly. Read closely the reasons given in the post and comments, their is substantial reasoning behind the outcry.

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55. Good pushback. Thanks. I’ve enjoyed the discussion.

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56. I haven’t been a fan of that song ever since I first heard it 🙂

    However, it’s not the most vapid CCM song that was brought to my attention today. That honor goes to one whose chorus is:

    “You have to believe you’re worth dying for.”

    Thanks. Jesus just left the building, cause apparently he isn’t necessary.

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57. Sorry, that came out longer than it looked. I’ll try to be briefer in future.

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58. I don’t know mate. I’ve been out of the loop of the current ‘christian’ music scene for a while. I just didn’t see how this song warranted the reaction.

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59. I don’t know why it should be against your better judgement, but thanks for going against it and replying. When I comment I don’t expect a reply, but I’m happy when one comes. I hope your apprehension wasn’t because of some perceived attachment to the song, or particular antagonism towards you.

    1. That whole image with the grace in the eyes, the ocean/sinking and the wet kiss, even the heart wrenching is a bride bridegroom image… you know, drowning in the ocean of your eyes sort of stuff. Not in total dissonance with the bride/bridegroom idea found in scripture, infused with a 21st century romantic idea of marriage. Fair enough, overly sentimental, but c’mon, that’s a matter of tastes.

    2. I agree that Amazing Grace’s narcissism is actually a valid expression of personal gratitude, which was my point, perhaps badly put in this medium. That was my point, and, no, I don’t see a great difference. This song is not about ‘“my heart turning violently inside my chest” when God gives me a sloppy wet kiss’. It’s about ‘afflictions eclipsed by glory’ and ‘redemption by the grace in His eyes’ such that ‘I don’t have time to maintain these regrets’. To me, barely different to ‘Through many dangers, toils and snares
    I have already come; ‘Tis Grace that brought me safe thus far’ and ‘The Lord has promised good to me. His word my hope secures.’ Please, don’t think I’, saying this is as good a song as Amazing Grace. Just that I immediately saw parallels in the sentiment.

    3. Aye, lovin’ the Psalms. My particular favourites are in the early 40s and 100s. Some of the old hymns are great. I’ve come across a few of the newer ones. Just glad to see it again, even in this thin way here.

    4. I WAS reading that as though you were saying that we should be quoting scripture, or at least reworded scripture. Sorry for that. I’m assuming that when you say it is required to be good you aren’t talking about a critics assessment of the musical or poetic qualities. I don’t think anyone’s got the kudos for that. I agree that we must express our experiences of God in ways which are in line with the scriptures, express the Gospel and presents images commensurate with the life and tradition of the church, past and present (although that would be one special song to do it all at once). I disagree that this song is not in line with that. It seems to me to be a quite 2000-2010AD expression of an ancient awe and wonderment at the love and grace of God.

    This is just my view. I think you’ve made a tall hill out of a termite mound with this song, but it’s not something I’d want to see enshrined in dogma.

    Peace.

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60. I actually like David Crowder much of the time. I thought Remedy was a fine album.

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61. Great, Martha. A dozen churches will now lead with this song on Sunday, and half of them will be in Tulsa…

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62. But this song had nothing to do with anything else in the service, as far as I could tell. And it certainly bore no relation whatsoever to the sermon that followed immediately after it.

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63. I have a suspicion that they actually chose to sing the song BECAUSE of the hurricane that was striking the east coast of the U.S. that day. I hope I’m wrong.

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64. You laugh, Isaac, but I read a vampire story back in the 90s that was a pastiche of the 18th century originals (e.g. Polidori’s “The Vampyre”) that used such language; the young lady on the Continental Tour with her parents who ended up in the stereotypical Eastern European vampire-haunted village used exactly such language in reference to poor, benighted Roman Catholics and their superstitions as compared to staunch English Evangelicals like her family who had the “Spurting Fountain of Grace” to thank for their salvation. (Naturally, such an attitude leads to A Sticky End).

    So at least one horror writer was familiar with this hymn and made the same connections you did.

    😀

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65. Oh…my. That’s hilarious!

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66. Okay, Headless, I took a song from the 90s completely at random, and here’s the Christian Music version of the first verse(s):

    Groove is in the Heart by Deee-Lite, re-done for Jesus, with modified lyrics within italics 🙂

    We’re going to worship,
    We’re going to worship,
    We’re going to worship
    And have some fun

    The chills that you
    Spill up my back
    Keep me filled with
    Satisfaction when we’re done
    Satisfaction of what’s to come
    (I) I couldn’t ask for another
    (I-I-I-I-I I)
    No I couldn’t ask for another
    Your Spirit I do deeply dig
    No walls only the bridge
    My Saviour, my Lord
    (Sing it baby)
    (I) I couldn’t ask for another
    (Uh-huh uh-huh)
    (I-I-I-I-I I)
    No I couldn’t ask for another

    Jesus is in the heart
    Ah-ah-ah-ah
    Jesus is in the heart
    Ah-ah-ah-ah
    Jesus is in the heart
    Jesus is in the heart
    Ah-ah-ah

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67. Just to be clear, in my mainline church we have to struggle to make sure we get some current music in! But we are careful about making sure it is God centered.

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68. I have been attending a mainline church for a few years and have found plenty of deep hymns and not many of the ‘Happy Christian Syndrome’ type. Some of them are translated from Latin!
    My old background had plenty of ‘gospel’ hymns like you get in an Assemblies of God church.

    The church has a long history of hymns, many really good ones.

    I have a relative who works at a national level in Christian circles and I was once complaining to him about feeling that worship had degenerated into a concert at my church, shallow lyrics, and many times songs being sung in such a way that you cannot sing along.
    His reply was that this is a national problem, in all church denominations that he knew of.

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69. For the soppiest, most sentimental songs I’ve ever sung in church (or other religious events e.g May processions, pilgrimages), it would be a toss-up between Bring Flowers of the Rarest (composed 1871) and As I Kneel Before You (1975), but this one has them all beaten.

    The notion of our God is a jealous god and that the love of God for His Church may be figured erotically (as in the Song of Songs) is certainly Biblical and Scriptural.

    Going “Whoa! Yeah! He loves me, yeah, yeah, yeah” – repeat ad infinitum – not so much. This song makes me grateful that we’ve sung nothing more modern than hymns dating from the 1980s, poor as they can be, round here (though I read American Catholic blogs on this topic mentioning the names of Haugen and Haas with fear and dread).

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70. Remember, everybody:

    THIS IS THE SAME TREY STONE AND MATT PARKER WHO DO “SOUTH PARK”.

    YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

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71. Don’t forget the Shatner Shlock version of “Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds.” Number One on Dr Demento’s Bottom Five the entire time Dr D was on the air.

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72. Well, wedding planners actually do get lots of requests for Sting’s “Every Breath You Take.” Listen to the lyrics sometime.

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73. Also: replace secular cliches with time-worn theological ones, preferrably about mountains, sun rises, and rivers.

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74. Eagle, you have just made my brain go TILT.

    I shall infect the entire IMonk massmind with two words:

    HOLY HICKIES.

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75. Loud boiling test tubes?

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76. For the worst lyrics, I nominate these:

    Well, I went to the enemy’s camp and
    I took back what he stole from me (x3)
    I went to the enemy’s camp and
    I took back what he stole from me

    He’s under my feet (x6)
    Satan is under my feet

    Sounds like “a 7-11 chorus” — seven words repeated eleven times (while everybody stands with eyes closed and hands raised over their heads, swaying like seaweed in a current).

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77. I’ve never heard of this song, so take the following with a grain of salt.

    Whatever the appropriateness of singing about “His love is a hurricane, I am a tree” after Irene hit, I have to say – the chorus expects you to go “Whoa, Yeah, Whoa”?

    No. Sorry, just no. The only time such responses are appropriate is in this context.

    🙂

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78. “Writing Christian music is simple. Just take 20-year-old pop songs and substitute “Jesus” for “Oooooo Baby!”
    — Eric Cartman, South Park

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79. Frankly, this song doesn’t seem any worse than most of the songs I’ve experienced in contemporary-themed worship services. It certainly shares their weaknesses and irritating traits, as spelled out in Chaplain Mike’s post and the comments above: fairly narcissistic, poor writing, and an emphasis/purpose on amping up the emotional side of worship.

    I hold nothing against McMillan, who rightly channeled grief, wondering and more into the gifts he’s been given. More of us should do that. And while I agree that this is simply a thin, flabby song for corporate worship, it’s a symptomatic problem, not a causative one. Simple, repetitive lyrics, poor writing, and weak, self-centered theology are rampant in the songs I’ve seen and heard used in contemporary services.

    Not that I think using nothing but dusty old hymns is the solution, either. A lot of those seem to emphasize the Happy Christian Syndrome, which can be just as cloying as the Warm Fuzzy Theology apparent in modern worship.

    I’d like worship music to challenge me, take me outside of myself, and focus on God for God’s sake, not for mine. And I’d like it to be free of time-worn cliches, too.

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80. Hymns of the Christian Life

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81. For me, the lyrics just sound too much like another love song. Its all about how I feel, which I suppose is legitimate.
    The sexual overtones are too strong for me. Sometimes I feel like some of this music is striking the same chord as popular love songs, only it is ‘baptised’.

    That is my thought without any deep processing.
    I think I would want to leave a service if that was sung

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82. Maybe it is just a difference between congregations that feel like things are falling apart from those that feel like they have everything together. This song expresses the feeling of your life falling apart but realizing the glory of God and how much He loves us even in the midst of the chaos of life.

    I think some of the problem is that some people feel like you have to have songs that encompass the whole gospel. If you aren’t covering everything, it isn’t a good song. But when you have a collection of songs, you can have songs of confession, songs of adoration(How He Loves), songs of thanksgiving. If the only song we ever sang was How He Loves, it would be an incomplete picture of God and what he does for us. But when you factor in the other songs we sing, the prayers that get prayed, the sermon that gets preached, it gives an overall picture of who God is.

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83. The end of this life is not The End. That is why I mention eternal destinies. In 100 years the person who lived like a king and died at 90 will be just as dead as the baby that dead in birth. If this life is all there is then it is all absurd and meaningless. God’s wisdom takes the long view; this life is the prequel to the next.

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84. Oh boy HUG…so I guess “Can’t Live a Day” by Avalon might be popular in a bathhouse… In terms of worship how about “Do You Feel the Mountains Tremble…” That would be appropraie before an orgasm no? 😛

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85. Yeah, I really questioned my spelling of Arminist and whether it was actually a word. But, I was trying to finish it up before heading to work so I just sent it in.

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86. Oh, thanks ever so much (dripping sarcasm) for the lovely flashback to singing this song in a church of 400 people, complete with the requisite jumping and stomping of Satan under our feet.

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87. And it shows David Crowder can turn any song into solid gold with his cool papery-sounding voice!

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88. I just read Dylan’s “Every Grain of Sand.” Beautiful. Even that song would not be a good one for a congregation to sing, though, in my humble opinon. It would be too difficult.

    I guess it’s good that we have all kinds of churches for all kinds of people. This “How He Loves” song would not be one I would wish to sing in church, but if it makes some people happy to sing it, it’s OK with me. I just wouldn’t join in and I can see how it would be a problem if you loved everything about your church except for the choice of music which you find to be grating, or shallow, or stupid, or overly emotional or too hard to sing. I am sure many new churches have started up because some of the congregation could not stand the music being played or sung any longer at their current church.

    I do like Gregorian chanting, but I don’t know if I would want a steady diet of that.

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89. Good point. I still think it’s a great CCM song. Don’t mean to sound argumentative, but I just love to argue. Even if I loose, its a win because I learn something. 🙂

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90. Chaplain, I tend to let folks go with whatever rocks their boat as long as they don’t expect me to climb in their boat. You mention as an alternative that we can read and sing the Psalms. I agree with you that this seems the best way out of what strikes me as a bad situation since I find most Christian hymns painful. My personal opinion is that songs in church ought to be sung to or for Jesus but I don’t have much company on that one.

    I finally started a search in response to your piece looking for examples of the singing of Psalms. Didn’t do so well, mostly coming up with a contemporary Presbyterian effort which to my ears sounded as dreary and offputting as what I recall from my youth. I wonder if there are recordings of Jews singing the Psalms? What about the Eastern Orthodox tradition? Does any of the American Black church sing psalms? And what about chanting the Psalms as opposed to singing them? I have heard goose bump prayers chanted in a Lutheran service by a classical symphony tuba player but never a Psalm.

    I’m sure the answer is out there somewhere but may I suggest Singing the Psalms as a topic for another day? The expanse of expertise and experience here ought to be definitive. I don’t see how to get around the problem of not posting links and don’t see how the information could easily be given otherwise. I am interested in listening to free samples of what is out there, not so much places to buy Psalters and CD’s tho that too. I am interested in opinions, preferences, and recommendations over a wide range of traditions.

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91. Ray, thank you for sharing your story. I have a feeling that there are many more folks out there with similar experiences.

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92. Uh, thanks, Lee . . . I appreciate your sincerity . . .

    You have to find Mitchell and Webb on youtube and watch the skit called “Talent Dredge.”

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93. That and “Infidels” are his best in my opinion. Hey, for fun, also watch Weird Al’s “Bob” video and see what you can figure out. It’s great!

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94. Not to mention, record sales is only an indicator of quality for pop-level music. That puts this song on par with Brittany Spears, accomplishing the breathtakingly beautiful goal of increasing the bottom line.
    Bach and Mozart both died in obscurity, yet they are the foundation of what society world-wide considers to be “music.” Take popularity indicators in stride.

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95. You’ve modeled a stereotypical problem plaguing the modern worship industry. The idea that anything devoid of abject heresy is appropriate for the gathered saints to utilize in celebration of the gospel is just abominable. There are plenty of cookbooks without any theological errs. Why don’t we sing them? Because they say nothing positive about why we are assembled!

    Your five points are outstanding discussion starters, though. Here’s a few thoughts.
    1. Balance is needed between simplicity and complexity. The abundance of songs like this one indicate we may be a little heavy in the former category. Additionally, not all repetition is equal. Taize is an outstanding example of excellence in simplicity in repetition.
    2. An absolute, imo. What is the point of having music if the assembled congregation serves merely as spectators? Too much of this makes it hard to distinguish worship from a concert. While there is certainly a place for an anthem, “special music,” or seasonal production in the life of a prosperous congregation, the times designated for everyone singing together ought to be designed with that in mind: How can we facilitate participation, rather than frustrate it? Melodies ought to be singable as well.
    3. Nothing wrong with diversity in metaphors. Ambiguity clouds understanding, thus defeating the purpose of the metaphor to begin with.
    4. Why limit this to simply music? How about an entire life devoid of self focus? Is this not what Christ calls us to as disciples? Should not our worship model and teach this?
    5. False dichotomy. Depth and quality is precisely what provokes genuine, lasting affection for Christ. Production driven emotional manipulation may produce a temporary high, but roots the sentiment in an experience rather than a truth. This never lasts and is thus counterproductive to the mission of the church to make disciples.
    There’s a little logic and reasoning to get you started.

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96. I’ll make ’em available in some way 🙂

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97. Good post. I knew it would spark a lot of conversation.

    I’m one of those who stand with my hands in my pockets wondering what’s going on a fair bit of the time with contemporary worship music. I think worship music and lyrics should be something we might actually sing or say if we really, truly believed we were actually in Jesus’ presence and knew what that meant (picture Aslan here if it helps). I think then it would be a lot less likely to be individualistic, narcicisstic, mushy, triumphal, and such. And we surely wouldn’t take anything for granted.

    The last church I went to frequently sang a song with lyrics that said “I’m wholly devoted, fully committted to you” or something close. I couldn’t sing it because the most I can say is that I want to be (on my better days) and that I’m trying to be those things by God’s ongoing and unfailing grace and mercy.

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98. > And of the recent crop: any “precious Jesus” or “me and Jesus” songs leave me cold

    What about “old crop” precious Jesus songs? 🙂

    ’Tis so sweet to trust in Jesus,
    And to take Him at His Word;
    Just to rest upon His promise,
    And to know, “Thus says the Lord!”

    Refrain

    Jesus, Jesus, how I trust Him!
    How I’ve proved Him o’er and o’er
    Jesus, Jesus, precious Jesus!
    O for grace to trust Him more!

    O how sweet to trust in Jesus,
    Just to trust His cleansing blood;
    And in simple faith to plunge me
    ’Neath the healing, cleansing flood!

    Refrain

    Yes, ’tis sweet to trust in Jesus,
    Just from sin and self to cease;
    Just from Jesus simply taking
    Life and rest, and joy and peace.

    Refrain

    I’m so glad I learned to trust Thee,
    Precious Jesus, Savior, Friend;
    And I know that Thou art with me,
    Wilt be with me to the end.

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99. Yep, that’s pretty bad, and arguably much worse than the song in question here!

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100. I understand, and I have railed against this type of music in worship before. I was a worship leader before I was a pastor. But, with this song, I see the Biblical imagery quite clearly and feel that it helps to illicit the response that is Biblically appropriate when mediating on the great love that God has for us – something that we are supposed to meditate on. It is one of those “things above” that we are supposed to think about.

     In worship, I like for the focus to be on God, but God is the one who decided that He loves us and showed that by sending Christ to die for us, even when we were sinners. So, even though it is a scandal, it is still true and perhaps, something that I should think about more often.

     Now, having said that, I share your concern for what we sing and how we worship. I also grant that I perceive this song through the filter of my understanding of the death and resurrection of Christ and not any nebulous idea of “Jesus as my cosmic boyfriend.” You caution is warranted. Still, I think that this song can be used appropriately if it is done with knowledge and understanding.

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101. got it. i am not being contrary for contrary’s sake…

     just expressing aspects of maybe a minor element in the intent of the controversial song that nonetheless i feel is still valid…

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102. Yes. You put into words what has been in that “just out of reach” corner of my mind. I’ve always liked this song but felt something just wasn’t right about this whole trend in congregational music.

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103. Jon Acuff started a great (and often entertaining) discussion about this song on his “Stuff Christians Like” blog. http://www.jonacuff.com/stuffchristianslike/2011/03/kissing-metaphors-in-worship-music/ Sorry if someone has already mentioned this–I’m late to the party and haven’t read through all of the comments.

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104. Dan..if God is a rightous judge what rightousness comes out of a murder of an Egyptian new born? The OT is full of stories like this, then God wants to redeem mankind and find a way for the payment of sin. Why is God so schizophrenic? Maybe he should stay on his meds….

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105. As I was reading the article I was waiting in anticipation for your theological rebuttal of the concepts or ideals in the song. But that point never came.

     It seems the main thrust of your argument is that the song should not be used in corporate worship. I was struggling to find strong support for that argument in the post (though I’m sure you have some and would love to hear it). If I were to garner your view from the article, the primary requirements for having a worship song in corporate worship would be:

     1) Complex poetry
     2) Lyrics that are in your opinion, not “clumsy” or “unsingable”
     3) Consistent and perhaps singular metaphors throughout
     4) Devoid of self-focus
     5) Not emotion-evoking, but rather depth and quality

     Well, I’m exaggerating a bit, :). But my point is, the song is simple, short, and stirs your emotion through repetition. If there’s nothing theologically incorrect in the song, is there anything so wrong with that? (Used in moderation of course). An occasional play in corporate worship…I really don’t see a problem. It seems any pop-style type song that’s meant to stir emotions of praise to God is disallowed on that basis only.

     I enjoy the classics as much as the next guy. Sometimes I’m moved to tears when we sing “How Great Thou Art”. At the church I attend we have a nice mix – songs with depth and quality (and big words), that call back to hallmarks of the gospel and high theological truths. We also have a popular song or two in there, which is simple, straightforward and yes, may have repetition and simple words. Honestly, I think it makes it more accessible to the random guy who walks in the door. Those songs stir his emotions, the other more “hymn” like songs will get him thinking. We’re emotional and rational beings, seems logical to appeal to both in corporate worship.

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106. …not to mention, no song of human origin is on the same playing field as the inspired word of God. Yes, scripture makes fantastic use of imagery. If you’re going to use imagery, why not employ biblical allusions? Or, if you’re writing the song, why not actually explain some of your imagery in the song instead of capitulating to the emo trend of ambiguous meaninglessness? For pete’s sake, there’s no direct reason to conclude this song is even about Jesus! Were it found on a desert island somewhere, this lyric would not be classified as being of Christian origin.

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107. A few years back, my husband and I moved from a more liturgical tradition (where hymns were mostly sung, with praise songs thrown in) to a more evangelical church (where praise songs are mostly sung, with hymns occasionally & apologetically thrown in). I can tell you I’ve been saddened by the “me-centric” repetitive praise songs I regularly hear now. I remember the joy corporately of worshiping God to songs like “Crown him with many crowns” and “Come ye sinners” and ALL the lines to “Amazing Grace” and as a new convert of 19, singing these hymns for the first time I felt the joy of connecting with generations past of the Christian community. I felt a sense of being a part of something greater than myself as I understood what my parents’ parents’ sung. Those songs taught me about God and about the gospel, about what it means to be a Christian. I doubt the praise songs such as the one you’ve mentioned can teach much.

     Incidentally, when the occasional hymn is sung at my church, I feel the whole congregation join in. I hear the often muted voices of the older members of the congregation who grew up singing these songs along with their parents and grandparents. They know the words, they hold a lifetime of meaning for them. Whereas when the new songs are introduced and forgotten week after week I don’t hear half the participation I do during the hymns.

     All this to say, that sometimes, during rehearsals, someone will want to cut out several important verses of a hymn, or make a chorus more repetitive, or mix 2 songs together (whose meanings do not relate.) And sometimes all it takes is one voice to (gently) speak up in defense of the meaning of the original song for people to understand the value of leaving some things the way they are.

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108. Wow – only Christians critique songs? Only Christians have disagreements amongst each other?

     It must be such a trouble-free world outside of the fellowship of Christians.

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109. First time I’ve ever come across the word Arminist. It sure beats accidentally spelling Arminian and looking like you have something against Armenians.

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110. Popularity does speak to something. Popularity ten years later speaks more. How many songs that were the rage 10 years ago are still considered “great”? Most are considered archaic, in the worship industry at least. As a pop song, sales are a the prime indicator. If its on the radio in 30 years, its a classic. In 30 years, this song might seem more like Sonseed.

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111. Chap Mike: yeah, i get the point. corporate vs. individual. yet God does not sacrifice my individuality in the midst of the congregation…

     worship is individual. even when done publically & corporately. i do not cease to be the one He left the 99 for. i may be back in the sheep pen/fold, but i am that one still loved, sought out, called by name by the One that thought me valuable enough to do so…

     point(s) taken. i do understand…

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112. Awww. When my puppies kiss me I’m reminded of the Divine. I’m grateful that they were at the shelter when I went there.

     But yeah, dog kisses at 2 in the morning usually mean an urgent need to go out for “air”, the first thought I get is NOT one of gratitude, but more like what again???!

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113. Only if it’s dead and what’s for dinner. If the lobster is alive, I don’t think that anything other than disgust or common sense would prevent a Jew keeping kosher from licking a lobster.

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114. Read the post again. I have no problem with Mr. McMillan and his freedom to write any song he chooses. My problem is with pastors who think this is appropriate for corporate worship.

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115. Point missed. The title of the post emphasizes my true concern. When will pastors and church leaders start truly leading rather than allowing the consumeristic preferences of their audiences determine how we act and what we sing in what is supposed to be the corporate gathering of the church around the Gospel?

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116. What about album sales? Isn’t that’s an objective criterion? It seems to be doing pretty well based on that… 🙂

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117. God’s word pictures are tied to the story of creation and redemption and are always read and sung within that context. This song is about me and Jesus.

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118. It would have been nice if he had put a few of those references tying his feelings to the truths of Scripture into the song. Then I could understand using it in worship. As it stands it is a personal song about how I feel about God meeting me in my experience. As Miguel said, perfectly appropriate for a singer-songwriter and a pop song. Not so much for a gathering around Gospel realities.

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119. I’m speechless.

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120. No, these people are “Christians” — they cannot get along with their own kind. Even heathens can declare truces but never will God’s “men” get along until they’re gone.

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121. I appreciate Alan Cross’s comments about the song above. I was starting to feel guilty for liking the song.

     With that said, as a Music Minister (yeah, I’m still called that) in a rural, family-oriented SBC church with half of the people wanting traditional services and half wanting “blended” services, I wouldn’t use this song for congregational worship. Its language is far more “intimate” than I would use for congregational singing, and, even in today’s pop-saturated culture, the melody is incredibly difficult for two people to sing together at the same time, let alone 20, 200, or 2000. The latter is a pretty big trend: trying to find new worship songs can be difficult, as I do believe we have lost a sense of “singability” in worship song selection, which is vital if you want people to, you know, sing along. So that’s not a song for us.

     As for Mr. McMillan, give him another shot and check out “Death in His Grave.” I think the poetry is better (challenging, even), the melody is better, and the focus is squarely on Christ, not me.

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122. Lyrics can be funny things. I remember as a young Christian happily crooning along while George Harrison sang about his “sweet lord”. It was only years later that the lyrics became un-garbled for me and I heard the background singers identifying his “sweet lord” as Krishna. Oops. Not surprising given that I used to think that the opening line to “Earth Angel” was “her thing, Joe”, but disturbing nonetheless.

     My point is this, most Christians are bombarded with metaphors (and there are numerous ones listed throughout the comments) some truly biblical, some not straight from the scriptures but theologically sound, and some just weird. The ability to discern between the second and third type is a skill that not all have to the same degree, so it shouldn’t be surprising that some enjoy, even embrace this song.

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123. I think this song just gets blasted across the board by thinking people. Hymns are, in a basic sense, sacred songs used for worship. Tim Hughes and Chris Tomlin are in the 2008 Baptist Hymnal, and rightfully so. This is a fantastic pop song, but a horrible hymn, or song for use in Church durring worship.

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124. Wow. If you don’t like the song, don’t schedule it or sing it. I’ve seen this song used of God dozens of times. Can’t we all just get along?

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125. Is there no objective standard by which art, music, or poetry can be judged? Experts in those fields would disagree. While there is a highly subjective element to all forms of art, ultimately there are objective criteria by which they are analysed. And by all criteria, the song by itself (production aside) comes up fairly low. It’s not all about our opinions and our rights to hold them. At some point, the worship of Almighty God deserves a bit deeper thought then our own personal preferences.

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126. Except that God is a righteous judge who knows the hearts and eternal destinies of all men and Hitler was merely self-serving. Similar actions on the surface don’t always translate to equivalency.

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127. Alan I thought God sent hurricanes to punish those of us in the Maryland/DC/Virginia area to punish us who have not voted for the Tea Party.

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128. Psalm 29:9
     The voice of the LORD twists the oaks and strips the forests bare. And in his temple all cry, “Glory!”

     Isaiah 61:3
     …and provide for those who grieve in Zion— to bestow on them a crown of beauty instead of ashes, the oil of joy instead of mourning, and a garment of praise instead of a spirit of despair. They will be called oaks of righteousness, a planting of the LORD for the display of his splendor.

     sure the word picture could be accused of over-the-top imagery, but God also has used similar Word pictures in His communication to us…

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129. So HUG in a mega church a couple can lean over the balcony of the second rail and say, “Look I’m flying” . Then they can run around the church while fleeing family. But if this is going to be like Titanic, the only question is…where do you have ths sex? Oh and don’t forget the provocative nude portrait, you know the Kate Winslot impression. Should that be done over the stage of a mega chruch? 😯

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130. Well, we should, at the very least, sing a heck of a lot more of them than we currently do. I say, hot on the heels of the hymn-rewrite movement is the re-discovery of metrical psalms. If this does indeed happen, I called it!

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131. Word.

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132. I think one of the real problems with “How He Loves Us” and an annoying number of CCM songs is that they fail to tie their emotional language to anything God has actually done, essentially removing the Gospel from worship music. We’re left with the spiritual equivalent of junk food, something that gives a (emotional/spiritual) rush, but doesn’t provide any real substanence, and is definitely not healthy if consumed on a regular basis.

     Bam…nailed it!

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133. Point.

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134. 🙂

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135. Though being so late to the game, I’m not sure if anyone will read this comment.

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136. In Mormonism they have a song called “I am a child of God” You wan’t to talk about cheesey!!

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137. Post it! Some of us just might have a good use for it.

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138. Every time I hear this song, I wish we were singing this instead:

     Here is love, vast as the ocean,
     Lovingkindness as the flood,
     When the Prince of Life, our Ransom,
     Shed for us His precious blood.
     Who His love will not remember?
     Who can cease to sing His praise?
     He can never be forgotten,
     Throughout Heav’n’s eternal days.

     On the mount of crucifixion,
     Fountains opened deep and wide;
     Through the floodgates of God’s mercy
     Flowed a vast and gracious tide.
     Grace and love, like mighty rivers,
     Poured incessant from above,
     And Heav’n’s peace and perfect justice
     Kissed a guilty world in love.

     I think one of the real problems with “How He Loves Us” and an annoying number of CCM songs is that they fail to tie their emotional language to anything God has actually done, essentially removing the Gospel from worship music. We’re left with the spiritual equivalent of junk food, something that gives a (emotional/spiritual) rush, but doesn’t provide any real substanence, and is definitely not healthy if consumed on a regular basis.

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139. One thing no one has talked about is the power behind the music. This songs success probably has less to do with the Lyrics and more to do with musical arrangement. Ultimately if you like the modern rock genre, you will like this song. You could implant any lyrics you want, so long as it matches the current cadence beat, and it would be just as popular. The song from a musical standpoint is pretty formulaic, with all the movement and motion that movie soundtracks try to achieve when telling a story (though this song is obviously covering smaller territory).

     Truth is, this song would be popular if it had completely secular lyrics.

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140. How prescient of the Jacobeans!

     (But point taken.)

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141. Good points about how CCM co-opts music. However if I understand correctly, the author has come to believe that the song’s popularity as a worship song is the answer to the prayer his friend prayed before he died. So he is not outside the system or its way of thinking here.

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142. Dylan’s “protest songs” made him famous initially, but they were mostly a brief phase he went through early in his career. His third album (not one of his better ones) is the only one that’s really heavily political. After that he distanced himself from the political-folk-music movement and only occasionally political songs. By the time the hippies were in full swing, Dylan was in his country phase. 🙂

     For the best introduction to Dylan, listen to Highway 61 Revisited and/or Blood on the Tracks. The first is more crazy and fun, the latter more serious and emotional.

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143. Do hickies count?

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144. Yes arn’t we loved in the D.C. area!! When I was enduring Hurricane Irene I wondered what Pat would say about the event. Actually when you conisder the path of the storm his college down in the Norfolk area got hit hard. What was their sin if I may ask? Some silently voted for Obama in 2008?

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145. Dumb Ox…is praise and worship like this, kind of like “Christian Porn?” The start of the song is almost cheesy enough…

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146. And I get that. I just think that some people seem to be attacking the song itself or the songwriter here. I don’t know if JMM ever dreamt that his song would become a standard in churches across the nation.

     I will also add this, I find it somewhat funny and/or sad how the trajectory of these things go. We used to sing this song in the campus ministry I was a pastor of, and that’s probably going back a few years before Crowder recorded it. The kids in the ministry appreciated the song because to them it was raw and struck a nerve. It was different than the other “industry standard” songs being peddled. Now, sadly, it has become one. It’s like the CCM world has a way of cheapening stuff – they make the precious just common.

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147. Comment of the week, I say. I’m tweeting this…

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148. So what is the alternative? Lady Gaga? Pink? or Katy Perry? Maybe they can sing “Hot and Cold” at a wedding or “I Kissed a Girl” 😛

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149. Just out of curiosity… If this song does not warrant the “vehement ban,” what on earth would you expect a song to contain in order to be worthy of it? Could you point to a better example? This one is up there with “Jesus is a Friend of Mines” by Sonseed, and “You Spin Me Right Round Jesus” by Rick Pino. …and the “its prophecied” song.

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150. Ah ha!. Your true identity is revealed. Admit it, you are Umberto Eco. BTW, I always enjoy the church history lessons HUG.

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151. I have so much praise and worship music I don;t know what to do with the stuff. I still listen to it occasionaly when I go to the gym. I’m determined to get my $15.99 worth from Family Christian Stores 😛

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152. Stay tuned.

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153. Great song story. However, I got ten bucks that says the vast majority of churches using this song are Baptistic in their theology, just not in their church’s name. Baptists-in-denial, I call ’em. When body and blood of Jesus is present in the worship service, it tends to demand more reverence than this song.

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154. How about when God is on one of his genocidal rampages against the Canannites, Egyptians or the world at large. Man I’m sure God’s attrocities would make Hitler blush. 😯

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155. The last verse is not sung in churches because it shows what the song is really about — a guy’s personal grief over the loss of his friend. Again, that is a perfectly valid thing to write and sing about, as a singer-songwriter. It is not what music for congregational worship is about.

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156. Looks like I’m late to the party here! First of all, CM, I love the phrase “evangelical consumer-industrial complex” and plan to steal it and use it at every opportunity.

     Secondly, gosh, that is a pretty awful set of lyrics. Having been out of the aforementioned complex for a couple of years now, I’ve never actually heard the song (or “Earth and All Stars,” for that matter) and should probably be thankful I haven’t. But it’s far from the worst lyrics I’ve ever heard used in congregational “worship” time — not even necessarily the worst example of the “God is my girlfriend” sub-genre.

     For the worst lyrics, I nominate these:

     Well, I went to the enemy’s camp and
     I took back what he stole from me (x3)
     I went to the enemy’s camp and
     I took back what he stole from me

     He’s under my feet (x6)
     Satan is under my feet

     I’d include the second verse, but there isn’t one. This song will be familiar to almost anyone who’s been in a Pentecostal service or a Christian summer camp — I sang it for years before realizing the problem …

     … where’s God in that song?

     He isn’t there. It says that I went to the enemy’s (presumably Satan’s) camp, Well, I went to the enemy’s camp, I took what he stole, and he’s under my feet. God has no place in this song — I’m the one doing everything! It’s triumphalism or “Kingdom Now” pseudotheology taken to its illogical extreme, where I can do all things WITHOUT Christ strengthening me. And yet congregations have been singing it for DECADES as a song supposedly to praise God with …

     I don’t think you can come up with a worse lyric being used in the American church today.

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157. Just like Nelson Derbyshire and the rapture? 😉

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158. It’s been three years since I have regularly been to a chruch service. I tried one donw the street from me, and man!! I realized that I am out of the loop. Can you imagine that? I used to keep up with everything released by David “Crowder”, “Krissy” Tomlin, Charlie “Hallmark” and that movement what was is called? “Passion?” Man sounds like the title of a pornograghic flick!! 😛 BTW..don’t forget the folks from down under in Sydney who have orgasms as they sung their hearts out in in a mezmorizing trance!!

     Now if you really want to hear a song…listen to the song by Trey Stone and Matt Parker in the Book of Mormon musical. It’s called Hasa Diga Eboweii. If you listen to it…be careful! Don’t get offended if you don’t like the lyrics. Cosnider thsi a warning!! 🙂

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159. And yet we’ve been taught that the church is the bride of Jesus. I can’t possibly defend the weirdness of this song, but our traditional language is full of metaphors that would seem pretty bizarre to those outside the faith.

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160. I couldn’t agree more with your sentiments on Lutheran Hymnody. I just switched to a LCMS congregation and their latest service book is the best one on the market, imo. I was convinced of that before converting to Lutheranism, and am having a blast as I begin to mine its treasures. There is no sensation like singing good news in a congregation of multi-generational believers. Singing mindless charismatic sentimentality in a nich-market-group assembly of evangelical consumers does not remotely come close, no matter how cool the band or high the production level.

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161. You’ve described one of the major problems of this song (and the whole “JIMBee” genre)–the misappropriation of Biblical metaphors describing the relationship between Christ and His Church for the relationship between God and each of us as individuals.

     In the Middle Ages, this was called “Bridal Mysticism”, and originated from several visionary nuns who expressed their devotion and ecstasy in highly-erotic language — the Medieval version of “Jesus is My Edward Cullen (sparkle sparkle)”. Such devotions as (composite) “Thrust me through with Thy Divine Love! Fill me with Thy Holy Spirit as with child!” that as entropy set in melted down into what was effectively Pornography for Cloistered Nuns.

     And the “eyes closed, swaying with arms extended”, “Jesus is My Edward Cullen Sparkle Sparkle Sparkle Squee” is just today’s version of Bridal Mysticism. A snug fit with a Gospel of Personal Salvation and Only Personal Salvation — “Just ME & Jesus and nobody else.”

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162. And excellent parody at that.

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163. btw, what is the current alliance hymnal? I have a collection and try to represent every denomination, but didn’t know they ever published one.

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164. I don’t like Fanny Crosby or the Gaithers for the same reason most of us hate this David Crowder song. It’s so sweet and sappy I’m afraid I’ll become diabetic.

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165. I think this conversation would be must more profitable if we talked about how to go about doing BETTER in worship instead of simply forbidding our worship leaders to play certain songs. Thanks, Allen, for the thoughts. I personally think a lot of worship leaders choose bad songs because they have not been shown what God-honoring worship looks like. And if they don’t know what they’re aiming for, we have to take the responsibility as pastors, congregants, and lay-people. to give them grace. And then we must coach them. Pastors who “just say no” are not leading. In fact, this behavior will probably hurt staff morale and undermine the worship leader. So how can we show them a better way?

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166. Brilliant! I think it also illustrates the point.

     Tears from laughing so hard.

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167. THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU for writing this. I was beginning to feel like I was taking crazy pills! This song is not worship! Worship is not a genre of music! Come on people, take a critical look at your cultural trends once a century or so… Love like a hurricane, I am a tree? Yeah, deeply spiritual. It just makes me angry the pretentiousness with which I see this song wielded. Narcissism is too soft a word here. I could not attend a church that uses this song. I could rant another 3 pages on this one, but I’ll stop here for now.

     That being said, it’s fantastic listening and belongs on anyone’s CCM playlist. Just not on Sunday mornings. Give me a break, puhleeze.

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168. “You might be a preacher, preachin’ Spiritual Pride,
     Maybe a politician, takin’ bribes on the side…”

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169. “while the congregation splits about 50/50 into the “eyes closed/arms extended/enraptured” group vs. the rest of us standing there with our hands in our pockets wondering what the heck is going on.” Ha! I’m totally the hands in pockets guy…

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170. We go to a C&MA church, and fortunately, don’t see much use of the hymnal. Some old hymns I appreciate and miss singing, but many of them are just as poorly written and dreadful to sing as contemporary – or even not-so-contemporary praise & worship songs. Not to open another can of worms, but Bill Gaither comes to mind…. sigh. Though I have older very godly friends who dearly love him and his music.

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171. “As the Deer” does at least have the advantage of being cribbed from Psalm 42.

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172. HUG,

     unfair – 1) plenty of guys do this; 2) this is a put-down of women, which I know you don’t mean.

     Your wit was meant for better than that – unless you’re being so subtle that I’m not catching something, which could be the case.

     Dana

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173. At least this isn’t the original Holy Ghost Hokey Pokey video — the one sung in a half-Richard Simmons, half-Michael Jackson “I’m not gay! Really I’m not!” voice.

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174. Beat me to it. I was thinking about the hymn lyrics “washed in the blood”

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175. @Greg: we also say “Let all be done to glorify God!!!”” — but we have serious questions about whether a song like the one described in the post DOES glorify the true God, or sets up a false idol in His place. Your response, while understandable in its frustration, doesn’t help answer those questions.

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176. I once messed somebody up because of that song, Joshua. It was in a home-group meeting, and we had just finished singing “I Could Sing of You Love Forever,” with its bridge:

     Oh, I feel like dancing – it’s foolishness I know;
     but, when the world has seen the light,
     they will dance with joy, like we’re dancing now.

     And then I asked, “but what if we DON’T ‘feel like dancing’?” (A reasonable question, I thought, from someone with two bad feet. And nobody had been dancing during the song anyway …)

     The leader of the group stared blankly at me for a few seconds before finally saying, “I … don’t know.”

     Slowly, my path out of the “evangelical consumer-industrial complex” was being paved …

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177. Well, the Worship Chorus at the top also brings vampires to mind —
     As in Edward Cullen (sparkle sparkle).

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178. I don’t care how bad it is, it ain’t worse than “Earth and all Stars” with its “loud boiling test tubes”. Makes me want to commit homicide.

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179. Speaking of which… do you know any good resources for singing psalms and canticles that wouldn’t totally freak out people raised on the ccm pablum? Most of what I’ve seen has been either chant or metrical psalters from the 1600s. I don’t really think either would go over well…

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180. I think the point is not so much that the song exists, but that churches have embraced it whole-heartedly because of the emotionalism it invokes rather than out of any real sense of discernment.

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181. The difference being that bad old hymns are largely forgotten today. The passage of a century or five is a wonderful winnowing process.

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182. Great point. Real sacraments (bread and wine) are much better.

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183. Nice exposition Alan.

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184. fro = for
     The preposition was intended, not the hair style.

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185. This song is about the overwhelming love of God for us, a theme that is prominent in Scripture. “For God so love the world He gave His only Son.” Ephesians 3 says that we are to have power together with all the saints to know the height, depth, width, and length of the love of Christ and to know this love that surpasses knowledge. 1 John 4:16 says that we are to know and rely on the love that God has for us – which was previously stated as a sacrificial love. Micah 7:19 says that our sins are hurled to the bottom of the sea. The pictures of grace that we see in Scripture (where sin abounds, grace abounds all the more) very much point to an overwhelming of our very being with the love and grace of God.

     This song is not perfect, but it attempts to tell of God’s love and grace in a way that is overwhelming, which I think is Biblical.

     God is jealous for us (James 4).
     Loves like a hurricane? The Spirit as a mighty, rushing wind? John 3, Acts 2.

     God’s glory is greater than our afflictions and we are to comforted with His unending love for us. What can separate us from God’s love? Trouble, hardship, famine, or sword? Romans 8:28-39.

     We are his portion and he is our prize? Clearly that is biblical.

     Drawn to redemption by the grace in His eyes? Sounds like a Rich Mullins song I know and love – “Heaven in His Eyes.”

     Grace is an ocean? Already talked about that.

     Heaven meets earth like an unforseen kiss? I kind of like sloppy wet kiss – it is talking about the Incarnation. That imagery shocks us and makes us deal with what really happened. God became flesh and made His dwelling among us. The Holy Spirit came upon a virgin. Ridiculous and scandalous to the extreme. I don’t like singing it, but it makes me think of what God actually did.

     Heart turns violently inside of my chest? All of this does have quite the effect, doesn’t it? Or, it should. There are many emotional responses throughout Scripture when people met the living God – fear, dred, jubilation, excitement, conviction.

     Don’t have time to maintain these regrets when I think about the way He loves us? We are to give our sin and past to God. We cannot justify ourselves but are to allow God’s love to change us.

     Brennan Manning would approve of this song, I would think. He spoke of these themes regularly.

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186. Having read Song of Solomon in the Hebrew, let me just say that our English versions are greatly toned down fro Victorian sensisbilities.

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187. it’s about time someone put their foot down and said that singing about God’s love for us is useless without good poetry and precise metaphors! if only that 20 something song writer had processed his grief about the sudden death of a good friend with a trained lyricist or doctor of literature, then maybe churches around North America wouldn’t have to put up with such a steaming pile! as it stands, i’m positive God refuses to receive the praises of a poorly transitioned and repetitive song.

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188. But this one crosses the line.

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189. I’m 35 and a huge Dylan fan. He is most certainly not generational or simply boomer music. I’m pretty certain I’m a bigger Dylan fan than my dad. I think he preferred Donovan. 🙂

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190. Was wondering when you would show up on this one! 😀

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191. I’m 23 and am educating myself musically with “Blood on the Tracks.” Love most of the songs on there.

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192. But both are unexpected surprises!

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193. A few thoughts:

     1. A couple of commenters have interpreted this as a worship wars, contemporary vs traditional critique. But I think that misses the point. Chaplain Mike isn’t criticizing this song because it’s contemporary. He’s criticizing it because it sucks, for reasons outlined in the post.

     2. GAAAHHHHH I’m sick of marriage analogies between individuals and their “husband” Jesus. I’ve heard people defend the “sloppy wet kiss” line by making comparisons to Song of Solomon. Well fine! Write an erotic love song to Jesus, just as erotic as Song of Solomon, including bits about Jesus saying your breasts are like twin does. I read something where Mark Driscoll points to a verse that he says is about oral sex–maybe you could work that in.

     3. The role of emotion really, really, really needs to be reassessed. Good works are not what earn us salvation, but they are a consequence of the grace that does earn salvation. Emotion in worship ought to be treated in a similar fashion–not the endgame, but a consequence, or a side effect. The way it’s treated in some places, emotion, or emotional engagement, is a sacrament. Think about it. It’s the high point of the worship service, it’s viewed as an actual, mysterious encounter with God, it’s viewed as sanctifying, and it’s considered essential for Christians to participate in. If that’s not a sacrament, I don’t what is.

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194. I guess I feel like I have to defend the writer here a little bit. If you’d listen to the original album that this song came from, I have a feeling people would be a lot less cynical about it. John Mark McMillan isn’t the typical CCM artist. I don’t even know if I’d call him a CCM artist. He’s released all his stuff independently over the last five years or so, and this song has managed to garner a broader audience. I don’t think he intended it to become a modern worship standard or anything like that. I take his word that he wrote the song as a response to the death of this friend. On the album, he breaks down while singing the last verse (which Chaplain Mike left out above).

     I just think of all the things to rail against in CCM, this is a bad choice. I feel bad for writers when things like this happens to their work. It’s kind of like the song God of Wonder that has been recorded by everyone and their brother. The guy who wrote it, Marc Byrd is like the antithesis of what CCM stands for. Yet, his creation gets sucked in by the CCM machine and it gets bastardized for ages to come.

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195. *formative years. Or were you formidable back then?

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196. Who was it in this massmind that said that Worship Choruses are really popular in the Gay community because where else can you hear a male singer crooning in orgasm about another male?

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197. South Park is a documentary.

     That steaming pile of Worship Chorus at the top should be credited to Eric Cartman.

     And there’s worse. For real. Remember “You Spin Me Round Spin Me Round Round JEESUS Right Round”?

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198. matt,

     a lot of this (and I am thankfully underexpsed to this sort of thing) just smacks of hubris, why re-invent the wheel, i know that it is not a great argument but can you really do much better as far as theology than some of the really great classic hymns,

     new music and arrangments i certainly understand, but this need constantly write the “new great thing” is just odd to me anyway

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199. “eyes closed/arms extended/enraptured” group…

     Let me guess — most of them female. With similar expressions as if watching Titanic for the 50th time or reading Twilight?

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200. I like P&W music, but the lyrics to “How He Loves” are just laughably bad. I don’t need to hold it up to a hundred year old hymn to see that. It makes “As The Deer” look like a Shakespearean sonnet.

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201. As I type this, I have a DeviantArt page up on my other browser tab. Reading a pair of Brony poems — hymns to Princesses Celestia and Luna, the god-figures of My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic. Either is far better as a hymn than that steaming pile of Jeezus-is-my-Boyfriend-Gasp-With-Trembling-Lips Pop Bridal Mysticism at the top.

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202. Yes. When my 6 month old gives me a sloppy wet kiss, sometimes I do think of Jesus, and how blessed I am. On the contrary, when my wife gives me a sloppy wet kiss, I most definitely am not thinking about the baby Jesus.

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203. That’s all fine and good Greg until you are at a church that is growing, not booming, but growing and being effective and you have very traditional music and no one is complaining about it, you actually have a lot of young couples and families, but for some reason the pastor replaces the music minister, and begins to alter the entire music program of the church, all because he says the Lord is leading him that way,

     now, as a pastor, especially an Anglican one (this guy was not Anglican) I can appreciate that a pastor/vicar/rector has final say on matters of public worship and that includes music, but you have to act wisely and tactfully

     this church in question was a traditional SBC church holding out with the choir in robes, great organist, pianist, etc. Very traditional, but very evangelistic and growing, not booming but growing,

     there are three other SBC churches and one non-denom too afraid to call themselves baptist that all are booming but they all offer a contemporary service and they are less than five miles away, why make the change,
     too often the folks that want to hold on are banished to some early morning service

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204. This is the problem I have with Calvinists critiquing Love Wins. You are setup by your basic belief(Calvinism) to disagree with most of the book. I appreciate more criticism coming from Arminists.

     Likewise, hearing someone criticizing How He Loves from the perspective of someone that hymns are predominately the way to go just doesn’t hold much weight. Within the space of Modern CCM Worship, I think How He Loves is a good song.

     I don’t understand all the complaints about how individualistic it is. It is about how God loves US. The focus is on God and what he is doing for us collectively not about me individually.

     This is one of my church’s favorite songs. With out new worship leader, we’ve been adding in some of the older hymns redone modernly (via the group Ascend The Hill). Those hymns are becoming some of the congregations favorites. But, How He Loves is still up there on the list. In fact, I know that we’ll be singing How He Loves and I Surrender All tonight when we meet.

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205. Well now. First time I’ve ever heard this song. I’m happily out of the loop on this one.

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206. Dylan is not, was not, and never was a political activist. He wouldn’t let himself be co-opted or used by those who wanted him to be “the voice of [insert your cause],” and in a way he was like the Pied Piper who led all the folkies away from Pete Seeger & Co. when they thought he was going to be their new Messiah. Watch the DVD The Other Side of the Mirror: Bob Dylan Live at the Newport Folk Festival, 1963-1965 to see him take over and then take away with him the folk music crowd. I don’t think they knew what hit ’em.

     Then watch Scorsese’s No Direction Home. And once you have those basic biographical facts down you’ll better understand (and enjoy) the movie I’m Not There.

     And, of course, listen to and enjoy Dylan’s music.

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207. I am tired of these “Worship Wars”!! Saying One chorus or hymn is better or worse then the other…I say Let all be done to glorify God!!!

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208. “heaven meets earth like a sloppy wet kiss”

     When my dog kisses me it never reminds me of God, especially before I get out of bed. Nor when I was a teenager and got my first such kiss from my girl friend, did God come to mind. I’m sure of that.

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209. I’m not offended, it just frustrates me when someone make a legitimate and intelligent critique of something and the response is, “Well, you’re just saying that because you’re an old fart.” I appreciate that you say you’re joking, but that kind of attitude is at least part of the reason that we have “worship wars.”

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210. there has been a trend toward more ’emotive’ worship & praise songs starting with the Vineyard music offerings, then bands like delirious? & the more recent David Crowder types.

     it was the Worship & Praise music of the late 90’s thru mid 2000 that was the most inspirational to me. and some of this music is really personal taste vs. theologically rich content…

     the song mentioned in this post as well as the Hillsong United song with questionable lyrics also mentioned in a previous post may not be the most musically pleasing or theologically solid or even be able to live up to their ‘hype’ & supposed supra-spiritual anointing they are claimed to have. but i did notice the college kids in the service Sunday geared to their generation unflinching while it was loudly played during the worship/singing portion of said service.

     no, i did not ‘sing along’, but it was not so painful to wait it out as i thought about the controversy that has been mentioned here. i don’t have any answers regarding the trend or if it is good, bad or indifferent. interesting perspectives though…

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211. Most oudated hymn in a hymnbook today, (or close second)

     The Roayal Telephone

     Central’s never “busy,” always on the line;
     You may hear from heaven almost any time;
     ’Tis a royal service, free for one and all;
     When you get in trouble, give this royal line a call.

     Refrain:
     Telephone to glory, oh, what joy divine!
     I can feel the current moving on the line,
     Built by God the Father for His loved and own,
     We may talk to Jesus through this royal telephone.

     There will be no charges, telephone is free,
     It was built for service, just for you and me;
     There will be no waiting on this royal line,
     Telephone to glory always answers just in time.

     Fail to get the answer, Satan’s crossed your wire,
     By some strong delusion, or some base desire;
     Take away obstructions, God is on the throne,
     And you’ll get your answer through this royal telephone.

     If your line is “grounded,” and connection true
     Has been lost with Jesus, tell you what to do:
     Prayer and faith and promise mend the broken wire,
     Till your soul is burning with the Pentecostal fire.

     Carnal combinations cannot get control
     Of this line to glory, anchored in the soul;
     Storm and trial cannot disconnect the line,
     Held in constant keeping by the Father’s hand divine.

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212. Not even The Count? 😀

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213. That was an attempt at a joke. Sorry i didn’t mean to offend.

     I’m tired of the worship wars in all honesty.

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214. i admit, i’m way out of the loop on dylan, probably b/c i associate him too much with political activist etc.

     i obvioulsy need to broaden my horizons some

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215. isaac there is nothing silly about vampires:)

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216. Of course, there’s William Shatner’s version of Mr. Tambourine Man.

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217. Canticles!?!? Now don’t let’s get too crazy now!

     Actually, I’m working on some settings for the some of the Canticles. I’m JUST about done with the Magnificat.

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218. Well, I will say this, Chaplain Mike, I have heard a lot of very bad renditions of this particular song. I actually don’t even like the Crowder version all that much. I particularly dislike that they felt they had to censor the barely scandalous word “sloppy wet kiss” with the nonsensical “unforeseen kiss”.

     The one thing I have noticed about congregational singing is that many newer songs are simply too wordy for people to actually sing along with. It’s OK for hymns to be wordy, I think, because those melodies have been around forever and the meters of the verses flow well enough that even people who don’t know them well can usually sing along pretty easily. That simply doesn’t seem to be the case with newer songs. I’ve been in many service where the worship leader or band is singing a song, but the congregation simply watches because they don’t know the song at all.

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219. Hear, hear!

     This is the same reason I can’t stand that song, “I Could Sing of Your Love Forever”: it says more about the person singing it than it does about God.

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220. I don’t care how young you are, that song is just bad. Not bad because it’s emotional, but because it is poorly written. Go back and read CM’s original post and his detailed responses to commentors. You can’t say that he’s just knocking it because it’s popular or because he’s an “elderly gentleman” or because it’s not highbrow intellectual, unless you just ignore everything he/’s said and fall back onto the tired old “get off my lawn” mantra.

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221. My FAVORITE South Park episode! What was their band? Faith +1 or something like that? So funny because it hits way too close to the mark:

     Executive: We just have one question, though. We were looking over some of your lyrics. (reads lyrics) I want to walk hand-in-hand with Jesus on a private beach for two. I want him to nibble on my ear and say “I’m here for you”. It seems you really love Christ.
     Cartman: Yes, we sure do.
     Executive: No, but it appears you are actually in love with Christ.
     Cartman: Well what are you saying? That, that you don’t really love Christ?
     Executive: Well of course I do. I mean I just –
     Cartman: Well what’s the difference? You love Christ, you’re in love with Christ, I mean, uh, what the heck is this?

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222. Er… *some*

     sorry, typing on my phone

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223. Ok, I agree that it is not appropriate for done church communities. It is for mine though.

     And “it’s not very good” is subjective.

     You are entitled to your opinion of course, I’m just saying I don’t agree.

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224. I KNEW that was gonna be the link! Oh, Lord!

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225. Knocking something because it’s popular?

     Erik, I thought I knocked it because it was (1) not appropriate for corporate worship, (2) not very good.

     And of course our emotions are not “off limits.” Come on, no one said or even implied that.

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226. Brilliant and accurate, Damaris. People lose the craft of poetry when they idolize their emotions. Some have this idea that to have good art, you have to lose control. I think it’s more accurate to say that you cannot have good art without self-control in some measure. Feelings come naturally – channeling them into a worthwhile expression takes craft.

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227. Sorry, Austin, but I gotta agree with Joel. I’m 32 and love Dylan. All my musician friends (most of whom are single and in their 20’s or early 30’s) are also huge Dylan fans. He’s just classic.

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228. My foot hurts, Phil, I must say.

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229. You’ve described one of the major problems of this song (and the whole “JIMBee” genre)–the misappropriation of Biblical metaphors describing the relationship between Christ and His Church for the relationship between God and each of us as individuals.

     Plus, as Chaplain Mike has so ably pointed out, the poetic, lyrical and musical flow of this song are painful. Whenever we sing it at our church (which, fortunately, is becoming less frequent), it inevitably devolves into the singers on stage wailing out the chorus ad nauseum while the congregation splits about 50/50 into the “eyes closed/arms extended/enraptured” group vs. the rest of us standing there with our hands in our pockets wondering what the heck is going on.

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230. “Jeff is my portion and Damaris is our prize,
     Miss Martha of Ireland waves the Pope in our eyes,
     If Liturgical Gangstas are an ocean, we’re all sinking.
     Internetmonk is like a wet sloppy kiss…”

     Damaris, tears were pouring down my face as I wrote this. It’s my heart…

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231. Favorite version of the MANY covers of “Knockin’ of Heaven’s Door”: Guns ‘n’ Roses.

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232. Heh, I don’t know that hymn, but the “fountain filled with blood” thing immediately brought to mind silly vampire movies

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233. Did some elderly gentlemen just poke me in the chest and tell me to get off his lawn?

     I love IM but time and again the worship music rants just leave me scratching my head. It’s ok to contemplate Jesus with our minds but our emotions are off limits?

     This song simply speaks of God’s unfathomable powerful love for us. That’s the message. You don’t have to love it, but this whole knocking something because it’s popular thing is much to hipster for IM if you ask me 😉

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234. Yes.

     Damaris is on a roll.

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235. But in congregational singing, the congregation’s voice should be front and center in terms of sound, not the band. That is the nature of congregational singing! Instead, it just sounds to me like we’re singing along with a record.

     (or watching a performance)

     +1

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236. As a minor quibble, you cannot compare Luther’s fear with Cowper’s mental illness since Luther suffered PRE conversion while Cowper suffered POST conversion.

     As a new Christian I thought “There Is A Fountain” was very bizarre, still DO actually. In fact, any song that plays primarily on personal emotion for its power is low on my list of favorites.

     And of the recent crop: any “precious Jesus” or “me and Jesus” songs leave me cold, I just won’t sing them. One Sunday the worship leader mentioned to me that he noticed that I sometimes didn’t sing along with the congregations so I told him why that was so. I said that if the song meant nothing to me then I would just close my eyes and let the melody ONLY lead me into personal worship. Better than just giving the leader who is talented AND a man of God, the old fish eye during worship.

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237. That’s actually one of the few newer worship songs (newer as in written in the last five years or so) that I like. Sure, it’s not a deep theological tome about atonement or whatnot, but I do believe it’s true. I think there’s room for hymns and simple choruses like this. Personally, I prefer newer worship songs that are less wordy than a lot of the stuff that’s being put out now. The songs that annoy me the most at present are the ones coming from the Hillsong and Hillsong United machine.

     I will also say I appreciate John Mark McMillan’s artistic sense a whole lot more than a lot of worship stuff being produced today. His albums are produced with a minimal amount of studio fluff, and they just come off a lot more raw to me.

     When it comes to declarations on worship music, I’ve found that people can put their foot down all they want. There’s plenty of people willing walk over the foot, though.

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238. He seems to be the Rod McKuen of CCM.

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239. I knew that someone would come back with that :). And I think the reason why I react so strongly to this song is that Jesus’ words are challenging words. As we see from the response to them, they were hard to accept. But as Christians, we have to accept them. But that doesn’t mean that we have do add additional hyperbole to what is already a difficult thing to accept.

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240. Anyway, Good post, PM.

     T

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241. Just celebrated 70.

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242. Most of the time. When emotion enters into it you can get some pretty good prose. “My God, my God, why have forsaken me!”

     Some of my best poetry (not that I have much) has been written when I am in an emotional state.

     Having said that, I love your analogy.

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243. To the credit of the church I visited last Sunday, the first two songs in the service were solid hymns, sung within contemporary arrangements. The only problem I had with those was that one could not hear the congregation (or even one’s self) singing very well because of the amplification of the music.

     I know I sound like an old, curmudgeonly codger, but I’m really not. I love rock concerts and loud music. But in congregational singing, the congregation’s voice should be front and center in terms of sound, not the band. That is the nature of congregational singing! Instead, it just sounds to me like we’re singing along with a record.

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244. I remember when I first heard this song, and I still can’t believe it’s considered worship music. It’s, cute and sentimental, but ultimately has little to say. Like a lot of music in the 2000s (and hardly just worship music — the Juno Soundtrack is as saccharine an anything you’ve heard on K-LOVE), it thrives on an individualistic, first-person, abstract views of God. There’s just not much to it. It reminds me of people saying how powerful Sigur Ros songs are, when it’s literally a guy jabbering in his own made-up language. Good music, yes, but not something I’d want to put as my Facebook quote.

     Anyway, it’s still not the worst worship music I’ve heard. A friend dropped off some lyrics to songs that a church member wanted them to do during the service. It’s was largely IHOP songs with such titles as “I Love to be Loved.” It all made “How He Loves” look like “Crown Him With Many Crowns.”

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245. Damaris,

     That simile preaches!

     T

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246. There is an easy answer to all of this and I’m not advocating it, but we could all sing the Psalms exclusively, plus perhaps a few Canticles?

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247. dang how old is Dylan then? I do confess to being ignorant in lots of regards, was he born before the late 40″s

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248. yea, really bad sort of like that whole “eat my flesh, drink my blood stuff” oooh,, “sarcasm”

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249. Is it not your experience that almost all CCM is virtually un-singable a capella, not to mention also un-singable by the Megachurch audience?

     In the HC we’re part of our repertoire is somewhat mixed, but has a majority of older hymns, some of which we borrowed from the Plymouth Brethren’s little black book.

     T

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250. Or Orthodox Jew for that matter . . .

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251. The problem that I have with the song is that the metaphors are not from the text. They are offensive hyperbole based losely on the text. Where in scripture do you get a fountain filled with blood? Try playing a video with that direct imagery in your church. People would walk out in disgust.

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252. Ok, against my better judgment, I’ll answer…

     1. The metaphors are ridiculous. “If grace is an ocean, then we’re all sinking” What on earth does that mean? Which leads to “heaven meets earth with a sloppy wet kiss.” Incredibly bad.

     2. What you call Amazing Grace’s “narcissism” is appropriate personal gratitude for the Gospel. There is actual theological content and context to the personal testimony in the hymn. In contrast, this song is about “my heart turning violently inside my chest” when God gives me a sloppy wet kiss. C’mon, you honestly don’t see the difference?

     3. You want “the fierceness of the man-God relationship with violent imagery”? Read and sing the Psalms or great hymns like “A Mighty Fortress” or “How Firm a Foundation.” There are contemporary worship songs that do this too. I’ll cite Matt Redmond’s “Blessed Be the Name” as an example. That is a song that puts one’s personal trials in their proper Biblical and worship context.

     4. I think you misunderstand my “treat worship music as another form of speaking and hearing God’s own Word” as though I am saying we should just be quoting Scripture to one another in our songs. That is not what I am saying. What I am saying is that we must always bring our personal experiences of God into line with the context of Scripture, the Gospel, and the life and tradition of the church. Songwriters are not free agents out there with a license to write anything they want to for corporate worship. Just like a pastor is not free to stand in the pulpit and spout his own opinions and feelings. No one is talking about “calcifying” worship music. We are talking about requiring that it be good and appropriate within the context of corporate worship. This song is not.

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253. Actually, I’m of the opinion that everyone else does Dylan better than Dylan.

     T

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254. I was raised singing that hymn by Cowper. It doesn’t move me musically, but lyrically the metaphors are straight from The Text. The truth that the imagery conveys is compelling.

     T

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255. That was my parody. That line isn’t actually in the song.

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256. The song becomes bearable if you view it as talking about God’s love for the Church, rather that for you as an individual (the fundamental flaw of most contemporary worship). I always just tell myself that the “heaven meets earth like a sloppy wet kiss” line is referring to the Incarnation, and how in Jesus God participates in all our messy, embodied life. If you take the Song of Solomon figuratively and Paul literally, human sexuality is in fact a physical parable for our spiritual union with God through Christ. After all, throughout the Bible marriage and romance and sexuality are used as metaphors for how God relates to God’s people.

     So, there’s nothing fundamentally wrong with using that sort of language in worship. The problem is just when we reduce that inconceivable, boundless love of God for God’s creation into a Hallmark-style, mushy sort of love of God for me as an individual. Our poetry needs to be _more_ extreme and _more_ shocking in that respect, not less – telling a story of a love story that spans all time and space instead of just making it about ourselves. We really _are_ caught up in a love stronger than a hurricane, but it’s a love that is transforming all of creation in surprising and sometimes frightening ways, not just a love meant to comfort us or give us a spiritual high.

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257. Oops, I meant to reply to someone else.

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258. My favorite religious Dylan songs are Ring Them Bells and Every Grain of Sand. And Forever Young, if that one counts. His cover of Lone Pilgrim is quite nice too.

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259. We did it Lee! Check HERE.

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260. Oh yeah, and Dylan is too old to count as a baby boomer. 🙂

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261. I’m 24 and I love Dylan, and my experience is that a lot of people who don’t like him don’t know his music that well. A lot of people think of him as mostly a political protest artist, which is far from the truth.

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262. “impaling me”!?

     That line can be interpreted in many different ways…

     INNUENDO INNUENDO INNUENDO INNUENDO INNUENDO INNUENDO

     Why is this song so sexual and violent? I guess it’s trying to conform to what we see in the movies and TV shows nowadays.

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263. I haven’t heard this song before, but reading the lyrics I see nothing as offensive as your criticism would suggest. The song appears to be all about God and his love, and how we are incapacitated in it’s presence. This seems pretty accurate to me. I happen to like the image the song provokes. I think, at the least, it is unworthy of the intensity of negative energy you have levied in it’s direction.

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264. Anyone else reminded of the South Park episode where cartman fronts a Christian rock band by replacing the word “baby” with “Jesus”, and ends up singing a song about taking God home and showing Him a good time?

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265. Are you kidding me?! William Cowper’s hymn is one of the greatest!!!

     I guess by your logic then even Martin Luther has some weird bad psychological/theological issue, since he was also racked with fears of going to hell until he realized God’s amazing grace.

     This is my problem with many Christians, they so easily deride the very real fears of other Christians who may be legitimately suffering from past traumatic experiences or upbringings. Why don’t you step down from your theological high horse and instead show the mercy and compassion our Lord demands of us.

     I may be taking this a little bit personally though since I find William Cowper’s hymn to be my favorite. It has helped me in times of great distress.

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266. Okay. 🙂

     Because I also wanted to say that, because of songs like the one you’re discussing, I long ago stopped wondering why I found myself preferring to listen to most anything by Bob Dylan than anything on Christian radio or what the big churches now play or have been playing for the last few years during “worship.”

     i still have several Hillsong worship DVDs. Maybe it was the three years of a capella Scripture and saint-and-theology-honoring songs in the Orthodox Church, but I can’t stand to listen to them anymore, either. I need to sell them or give them away. 😮

     While in our small home church we sing some of the charismatic songs from the past, and maybe some newer worship songs, we seem to primarily like the Psalm-based or Scripture-quoting songs, ISTM. Megachurch music doesn’t suit me well anymore, and I don’t think it’s just ’cause I’m getting old, but that may be part of it.

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267. Chaplain Mike: AMEN AMEN AMEN……and this is a lesson all houses of worship could learn from. :

     Build congregations, not audiences.
     Make disciples, not entertainment or emotional thrill seekers.
     As with all areas of ministry, lead people toward maturity.
     Treat worship music as another form of speaking and hearing God’s own Word.
     Honor the music of the church by demanding quality and depth and artistic integrity.
     Put your foot down.

     In the nearly 20 years that I have worked in ministry….it is the complete lack of empowerment that drives me crazy and worship music can certainly serve as a tool of this kind of enabling. When we build audiences, thrill them, entertain them, all we are doing is creating a flock of co-dependent followers. Few, if any will be compelled to enter into the searching stage of spiritual development, therefore few will become mature in their faith. I can’t tell you how many times I heard the ” I’m here for my Father _______ fix” or “”It’s Father ______________or nothing.” Really? We’re here for Jesus aren’t we? Or, are we there for the charismatic preacher or entertaining rock band? ARGH. Thank you for shining a light on the co-dependent patterns of church and for putting your foot down!

     Lauri Lumby
     Authentic Freedom Ministries
     http://yourspiritualtruth.com

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268. Dylan is purely generational, a manifestation of boomer narcism and the belief that everything starts and ends with them, When will be free of that generation? 🙂

     Dylan is not on the radar of a single friend my age.

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269. Hey, l lke Cowper’s hymn. Geez.

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270. Oh Damaris…classic!

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271. The point being, any good God-fearing Baptist would also refrain from licking a lobster…

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272. Jackson Browne said on his Acoustic I album that there’s a Spanish version of “Take it Easy” where “I’m looking for a lover who won’t run for cover” was translated into something along the lines of “I want to lick you like a lobster with pink sauce”…

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273. Fanny Crosby (“Blessed Assurance”) set hymns to the tune of Stephen Foster’s and other pop music from that period…does that make her the “Apologetix” cornball Christian songwriter of her age? “Sweet home up in heaven…Lord I’m coming home to you!”

     You know, I actually kinda like David Crowder. I’ve never heard the “sloppy wet kiss ” version. The person who came up with this worship idea, on the other hand, is likely headed straight to hell…

     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaJyljYa-0U

     How about a post on the “Holy Ghost Hokey Pokey”, CM?

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274. “Baptists aren’t into dirty frenching Jesus.”

     And with that, my morning is made 🙂

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275. I think Dylan’s incomprehensibility is better defined as induced rather than as intentional…

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276. We have this song “I’ll Do My Best” that we sing at church. I absolutely hate the theology behind it, everything seems wrong about the words.

     What have I discovered that many pastors seem afraid of the musicians. Often, even the pastors acknowledge a song’s words are bad, but they are so afraid of being “out of touch” they are afraid to say no. The musicians can be so out of touch with historical Christian beliefs, they are unable to pick out appropriate songs.

     I am not usually a big fan of committees, but I really believe churches should have a worship team made up of lay people, theologians, and musicians who read over the words in songs before they are ever sung in the congregation.

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277. Sheesh. Poetry is a craft, not an emotional paroxysm. Thinking that poetry is what happens when you sit down with a pencil and a racing pulse makes as much sense as thinking that carpentry is what happens when you hold a hammer and sneeze.

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278. Bravo, Bravo, Chaplain Mike. I haven’t heard the song (I’m Anglican, one of God’s frozen chosen), but thanks to you, I will flee from any manifestation. Has anyone ever composed a list of the 10 worst contemporary “worship” songs?

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279. Ya have to admit, though, that Dylan’s “You have to Serve Somebody” is great, and would even qualify as worship music some places!!

     “It may be the Devil, or it may be the Lord, but you’re gonna have to serve somebody!”

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280. Amazingly, I never heard this song (that I can remember) until after I came to Japan a few months ago and my brother made some comment about this song and how big it was, prompting me to go listen to it. I was thoroughly unimpressed and couldn’t figure out why everyone liked this song so much. I didn’t really notice the infamous ‘sloppy wet kiss’ line, but I can’t even begin to try defending something so ridiculous.

     This song seems like the logical progression of the “Jesus is my girlfriend” vein of worship music, and I can’t stand the sentimental imagery and narcissistic , individualist distortion of Jesus and God’s character. Nowhere in Scripture do I recall reading about a mushy, sentimental Jesus. Nor do I read about Jesus the Bullfighter that Mark Driscoll so loves. The real Jesus makes us feel nervous and uneasy, hopeful but anxious, and challenges and sometimes even scares us. I feel like I know that Jesus loves us, but what that love looks like is so much more complex than the pedestrian romance peddled by contemporgeical churches.

     They aren’t a worship band, but avant hard-rockers My Epic (silly name aside) is one of the only groups I’ve ever heard that I felt came close to capturing it in songs like this. It’s dark, desperate, and refreshingly honest. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCnlpZfVD4c

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281. Hey, I’ll jump on the Devil’s advocate bandwagon here.

     I hadn’t heard the song (that’s how far out of the evangelical commercial-industrial complex I am as well). Just looking at the lyrics:

     You may be railing against the hype, and against what may have been a poor choice given the context of the sermon, but the poetry is ok, nothing special but I’ve seen worse in some ‘classic’ hymns. The metaphors are clear enough. Incredibly fast paced, admittedly, but a hymn such as Be Thou My Vision has as many changes in metaphor. As for narcissism, I’d suggest that Amazing Grace is at least as narcissistic, and only the final stanza of Amazing Grace saves it from the charge of individualism, and that stanza is a later add-on. At least the lyrics are recapturing, in some very small way, the fierceness of the man-God relationship with the violence in the imagery, the absence of which is something which turned me off church ‘worship’.

     I don’t see how it is that bad as to warrant such a vehement ban as what you are describing. i’m not saying it’s any sort of great theological treatise. I’m no lover of the ‘Christian love song’ in general, and I’d probably roll my eyes if I heard it in a service, but the polemic is a bit overboard, no?

     On your call to ‘Treat worship music as another form of speaking and hearing God’s own Word,’ I’d have to put my foot down and say NO! You go too far. There is a balance to be struck. Agreed, don’t let a piece of music or poetry be the center of the corporate worship, but to limit the material used in what is called ‘worship’ in churches right now to that is unnecessary and wrongly calcifies it, effectively making the relationship with God a historic event which is not to be expressed in present terms.

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282. Another “me, me, me me, whatcha gonna do for me God” song?

     So where is the surprise?

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283. Ok. Devil’s advocate time: can a Lutheran find a “Bondage of the Will” message in this song?

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284. I first heard this a year and a half ago when a young missions volunteer taught it in English to our church in Bolivia. The melody was pretty, and I could ignore the inanity of the first verse. The chorus was boring, but it’s a rare chorus now that isn’t. Then the second verse. Grace, sinking… if this is supposed to be meaningful/intelligent then we’re singing about Irresistible Grace and I refuse. Of course, there’s nothing intelligent about it which means the drowning just sounds uncomfortable.

     and then.

     Sloppy wet kiss.

     That line popped up on the Powerpoint and all of the native English speakers choked. Incredulous eye contact was made from person to person. No one could decide whether to burst into laughter or vomit in abject disgust.

     Yeah. We didn’t sing it again.

     So, imagine my surprise when I returned to the States after four years on the field and discovered that nearly every church I visited sang the silly thing… albeit always without the sloppy wet kiss.

     Baptists aren’t into dirty frenching Jesus.

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285. Yup. Incomprehensible.

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286. Pat Roberston got it all wrong. God sent an earthquake and a hurricane to Washington to show how much he loves the place. 😛

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287. That hymn was written by William Cowper, who battled insanity throughout his life, of whom Chesterton wrote, “…he was definitely driven mad by logic, by the ugly and alien logic of predestination. Poetry was not the disease, but the medicine; poetry partly kept him in health.” Bad theology makes music bad and the saints ill.

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288. My Dylan remarks were tongue in cheek. See my review of Blonde on Blonde in June for a heaping helping of praise.

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289. Wow. I knew what song you were talking about long before I clicked, “read more”.

     It really is a confusing song. It sounds like a me-and-Jesus song, but in the end it is an overpowering and dehumanizing view of God. There are a lot of “worship” songs like this now: Jesus take me, take me now, baby oh baby oh baby. But it is the hidden message of revivalism: overpower the will with emotionalism to the point of an altered subconscious so that the “preacher” has a hypnotic control over the congregation. Anyone who resists or heads for the door is under the power of the devil. There is something enticing about drowning in a sea of love, but it isn’t the gospel. Don’t go into the light.

     It also seems to portray tragedy in life somehow as a demonstration of God’s jealous, loving willl for us. Had I not screwed up, I wouldn’t know how much God loved me; that’ll teach me.

     His love is a hurricane,
     uprooting a tree,
     hurling down the lane,
     and impaling me.
     Oh how he loves us.

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290. Agree with you. I checked out some youtube videos of the song done by different groups and this is a song that obviously has deep impact on many people, but much more suited to one’s individual contemplation than corporate worship. On one of the postings, there were 10’s of thousands of comments, only 10 of them unfavorable, and people were commenting on how in the world could anyone possibly dislike this song. Meaningful and touching in some settings, bad fit for Sunday morning corporate worship and teaching.

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291. Michael, you are correct. “New” has no monopoly on “bad.” Plenty of bad hymns out there too.

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292. I admit I am biased… the music coming out of the singer/songwriters of the late sixties/earlty seventees I find appeal to me the most – except for a time in the mid 90’s… yes I am talking about rock…. Country – although once appealing fell into formula with overused lyrical fragments, rock -same or just downright terrible lyrics.

     As for worship music – i am a traditionalist – prefering hymns from my formidable years. I never caught onto the whole christian Music thing… with few exceptions most of what i was exposed to was just bad music and cheesy lyrics that i was suppose to like because it was christian, but I just couldn’t. Like the sappy christian movies put out over the last few years.. they just couldn’t compare to classics like the ten commandments or even The Robe (with Victor Mature).

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293. Actually, I meant to compliment Bob Dylan and I was being a little tongue-in-cheek as well. His incomprehensibility was usually intentional.

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294. “sloppy wet kiss” might just as well refer to the affectionate servile overtures of a family dog that is trying to be friendly and lick your face.

     I think the caveat about the difference between Christian music as a vehicle for individual reflection and Christian music as liturgical device is an important one. There are all sorts of remarkable pieces of music that have spurred my contemplation as a Christian but that doesn’t mean that those works should be performed in churches. Penderecki’s Lukaspassion, for instance, does an amazing job of musically depicting the sufferings of Christ but that doesn’t mean any church could ever possibly use the music. 🙂 It often feels like the main trouble with contemporary Christian music isn’t simply bad lyrics or awkward music but a mismatch between music as personal expression and music as congregational aid. The best written music with the best written lyric that can’t be sung readily by a congregation can still be bad music for a congregational setting. Back in the Reformation and CounterReformation all sorts of issues came up so we can at least say that all these debates back and forth about what is and isn’t appropriate in church music isn’t new. 🙂

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295. Hear, hear, Chaplain Mike. I escaped the evangelical world for the Lutheran church a couple of decades ago because a.) Lutheran theology, the way of the cross, is right on, IMHO, and b.) the meaty hymnody of the Lutheran tradition. I would likewise be appalled to be expected to sing a song like that.

     Oh, yeah, people can’t sing any more.They have loud bands to cover up that fact. Ever heard a pitiful rendition of something like Happy Birthday at an office celebration? Its a crime. Or tried to actually sing the national anthem at a ball game? Dreadful.(I sing it in time, on pitch, and know the words, and half the section turns around to see who the heck is actually singing.)

     Not sure I agree about Dylan, and I wasn’t a first go-round fan-girl. Dylan is a poet of the first order. His recent album “Modern Times” is a masterpiece. I’m impressed that he can do all that with mostly one syllable words, too.

     Keep on stirring the pot, baby!

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296. I’m not sure which is worse: The song you’re criticizing, or your dissin’ Bob Dylan.

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297. Amen and amen!

     I was at a gathering once where this song was sung (with the “sloppy wet kiss” line) and I wasn’t sure whether to laugh or cry. If only it were a joke…

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298. Yup. Poorly written song. I don’t lead worship currently, but thankfully our worship leaders have managed to avoid this one.

     My worst worship song of all time as far a lyrics go is….

     “There is a fountain filled with blood, drawn from Immanuel’s veins, and sinners plunged beneath that flood lose all their guilty stains.” Circa 1790s.

     But if you want unsingable, try most hymns written by A.B. Simpson (the founder of the Christian and Missionary Alliance). His sense of meter was absolutely dreadful. As A.W. Tozer wrote: “…it is in the music that his songs suffer the most. A few of his compositions can be sung, but the most of them can be negotiated by none except trained singers.” The current Alliance hymnal still contains 44 of his 162 hymns.

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299. Meh.

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